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Thread: Stubborn Thrush?

  1. #1
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
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    Default Stubborn Thrush?

    Hi ladies... hope you can help.

    After lots of recurrent plugged ducts and 2 bouts of mastitis, I was diagnosed with ductal candida (deep thrush). I was given Fluconazole 100mg, once a day, for 2 weeks. Baby was treated with Nystatin. She finished her nystatin, and I have 2 days left on the fluconazole. I've also been taking acidophilus probiotic (10billion units once a day). Washing laundry in super hot water, too.

    The stabbing breast pain had gone away for about a week, but now it's back! Last night, I had night time breast pain, and now stabbing pains after pumping this morning (both sides). The tips of my nipples are starting to turn white, again, too. And theres is a deep itch in the fleshy area of my left breast that is driving me crazy. It feels the same as before, but I haven't even finished the medication yet. Has anyone else experienced this?

    Should I ask for a higher dosage? Does baby need to be treated again if I get medication again? She hasn't had any symptoms through all of this. Any other advice on how to beat this? I know it can be hard to get rid of thrush... any advice would be greatly appreciated!

    Also, any thoughts on baby gassiness? DD has been ridiculously gassy in the past couple of days. Everytime she so much as moves an arm or leg, she farts! I've never heard so much gas before. She's even been passing gas in her sleep! Do you think it is related to the candida? It seems to just have started in the past three or four days. I can't think of anything I've eaten consistently over 4 days that would cause this.

  2. #2
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    Mar 2007
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    Default Re: Stubborn Thrush?

    I found this guys information to be helpful after my 7 month battle with thrush. My heart goes out to you!
    (I copied and pasted this article which was sent to me in an email today.)

    Thrush is a horrible battle, but we finally won after eliminating all sugar and carbs while using probiotics for me and my lo. During OUR battle we took all kinds of medicines only to see it return with a vengence after a short term leave. When it finally left we were on no other medicines except the probiotics and grapefruit seed extract.

    Good luck! I hope your battle is short lived!





    NOVEMBER 6, 2007
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    Article Highlights:
    NYSTATIN

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    The Biamonte Center for Clinical Nutrition


    NYSTATIN AND DIFLUCAN, THE MYTH EXPOSED

    By Michael Biamonte, C.C.N.

    CONSULTATIONS BY PHONE
    Call (212) 587-2330
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    There exists the myth that Nystatin and Diflucan are very powerful antifungal treatments. This myth exists due to the fact that they are the most prescribed and revered antifungal. It also exists because the drug companies and your Doctor may say it’s so.

    However the herbal kingdom also contains antifungal substances. In fact there a dozens and dozens of different antifungal compounds that exist in nature in the forms of herbs.

    The purpose of this article will be to reveal the myths, the pros and the cons of both the herbal antifungal and the prescribed drugs such as Nystatin and Diflucan.

    Nystatin and Diflucan are given to patients who suffer from chronic fungal or yeast growth. The fungal yeast growth could be anywhere in the body, the intestines, genitals, mouth etc. The assumption is that the medicine will kill the fungus, it will go away and all will be well. This is about as ignorant as the person who invites Osama Bin Laden or Charles Manson to his home for dinner and expects to have a nice quiet evening at home.

    Limitations of Nystatin and Diflucan

    Nystatin is particularly known for causing drug resistance in different strains of Candida Albicans. It has done this for several reasons. One is that it has been so widely prescribed. Millions of individuals prescribed this drug equals billions of colonies of Candida have had a chance to mutate against it. Beyond this however, it is typical for Nystatin to be prescribed for periods of time that exceed 30 days. My contention is that drug resistance in Candida colonies begin after the colony has been exposed to the same medication for 21 days continuously. Nystatin can be prescribed for 30,60 or 90 days at a time.

    Diflucan is rarely prescribed for that long because it is simply too toxic and may cause liver and kidney damage. However is it not as toxic as Nizerol which could cause a disaster if prescribed that long.

    Nystatin is active mostly in the intestinal tract and is poorly absorbed systemically. This is an advantage of Diflucan or Nizerol in that they are absorbed systemically and are not limited to the intestinal tract.

    Dysbiosis

    The definition of Dysbiosis is an imbalance in the intestinal tract of normal intestinal flora. Lactobacillus Acidophilus which inhabits the 40-60 foot long small intestine and Bifido Bacterium which inhabits the 6-8 foot long colon are the most abundant protective bacteria in the digestive tract. They help produce vitamins, help us digest and absorb nutrients from our foods and also protect us from harmful bacteria, parasites and yeasts which find their way into our digestive tract. When medication such antibiotics, steroids, antacids, and immune suppressing drugs are taking these friendly protective organisms die-off. This condition is called “Dysbiosis”. “Dysbiosis” is a state of imbalance where the harmful micro-organisms achieve an abnormal dominance over the good organisms. This allows a build up of toxins produced by the organisms and also disrupts normal digestion. Due to this, stomach acid and enzymes produced by the pancreas that digest foods (particularly proteins) lessen. This leads to incomplete digestion of proteins.

    It is impossible for someone to have an overgrowth of Fungus or Yeast without also developing Dysbiosis. This is because once the friendly flora that protects us from Fungus or Yeast in compromised the growth of harmful bacteria and parasites occur along with the Fungus or Yeast. Does Nystatin or Diflucan kill harmful bacteria or parasites? The answer is no!

    So if you use these drugs to eliminate your Candida problem and if you are lucky enough that they do indeed eliminate it, you are still left with the harmful bacteria and the parasites the make up the remainder of your Dysbiosis. That being the case the harmful bacteria and the parasites prevent your friendly bacteria from growing back despite the hundreds of dollars you are spending on acidophilus and probiotics. So what happens in time? Well of course, the Candida grows back again? Why? Because you treated Candida only and not the complete problem which is the Dysbiosis!

    Why Use Herbs?

    1. Antifungal herbs are plentiful do you can rotate 3,4 or 5 different ones taking each one for 4, 7 or 10 days at a time and then moving to another one without ever causing dug resistance to occur.

    2. Herbs are much less toxic then the prescription antifungal drugs.

    3. All the antifungal herbs are to a greater or lesser degree also effective against harmful bacteria and parasites. So when you use the herbs you’re treating the Dysbiosis and not just the Candida. This gives you a better chance a eliminating your Dysbiosis so that the acidophilus will grow back!

    They “cons” regarding using herbs are very few. Allergic reactions may occur in very sensitive individuals to some of the plant substances in the herbs. That aside there are none.

    So while in fact there is the myth of Nystatin and Diflucan being so powerful, you now may see that they are nothing more then big bullies who can’t ever do the job correctly so like all bullies their own short comings lead to their eventual failure.




    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------


    Michael Biamonte holds a Doctorate of Nutripathy, a Degree in Natural Healing, and a Master's in Clinical Nutrition. He is affiliated with the International Academy of Clinical Nutritionists and the International Academy of Nutrition and Preventive Medicine. He is listed in "The Directory of Distinguished Americans" for his research in Nutrition and Physiology.

    For an appointment, contact our office at:

    Michael Biamonte, C.C.N.
    139 Fulton St.
    Suite 507
    New York, NY 10038
    (212) 587-2330


    CONSULTATIONS BY PHONE
    Call (212) 587-2330
    www.health-truth.com

    Have a blessed day! Maria
    Romans 12:2

  3. #3
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    Sep 2007
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    Default Re: Stubborn Thrush?

    I had won the battle before months ago using Gentian Violet to swap LO's mouth, after insuccessfull treatment with Nystatin. Now I have it back since about 2 weeks, also she is symptom free, I think it got it through an open milk blister this time. I am using Gentian Violet again, but it's not gone yet, so I am going to get some probiotics and grapefruit seed extract today, hope it will help. I think that mine is also deep in the milk ducts from the way it feels ...

    It makes sense that you have to restore your hole intestinal balance. I am trying to cut back on sugar and carbs, but it's hard to eleminate them completely. I did ok before without doing that. But it may be the only way ...

    Good luck!

  4. #4
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    Default Re: Stubborn Thrush?

    The gentian violet worked well for me, too but be careful- it stains. I put it on my nipples before a feed to get it in lo's mouth. I also added a cup of vinegar to our wash (in hot water) and rinsed my nipples after each feed with half vinegar half water.

    Also, sterilize pacifiers, bottle and pump parts (if you use them), toys that lo puts in mouth, etc every day by boiling for 20 minutes.

    This is what finally kicked it for us. Good luck!

    Oh, the nystatin really upset my lo's tummy, it could be that. That's why I used gentian violet the next time we got it. It also could be the yeast in her tummy, but the nystatin should be taking care of that. Watch her diaper area for signs of yeast rash there as well- if it's in her tummy, it migh end up there too.
    “We are not put on earth for ourselves, but are placed here for each other. If you are there always for others, then in time of need, someone will be there for you.”
    --Anonymous

  5. #5
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    Aug 2007
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    Default Re: Stubborn Thrush?

    Thanks so much for the replies. I will try vinegar in the laundry and after feeds. I've been cutting out sugars, too.

    I have been calling the local pharmacies for gentian violet, and nobody has it in stock. I'm looking online at amazon.com and they have a 1% or a 2% solution in 10% alcohol? Does this sound right? Any suggestions on whether I should get the 1% or 2%? I am thinking 2% because it is stronger, but have read that it can cause ulcers in LO's mouth, so I'm not sure if stronger is better?

    Also, should I ask for another prescription for nystatin and use it at the same time? Has anyone used them both together?

    I really hope we can kick this thrush... the poor baby is going through so much -she has RSV right now (after one week at daycare!).
    I pump at work, twice each day, and I can't sterilize the pump parts. I just wipe them down with medela antimicrobial wipes and put them in the fridge. They get sterilized daily at home. Do you think this is enough? We have a microwave sterilizer. I just feel so desperate to get rid of the thrush!

    When we do get rid of it, any suggestions on how to keep it from coming back? Thanks so much!

  6. #6
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    Jan 2006
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    Default Re: Stubborn Thrush?



    1% solution is what is needed.

    Here's some info on diflucan and bfing:
    http://www.kellymom.com/newman/20fluconazole.html
    GV and bfing:
    http://www.kellymom.com/newman/06gentian_violet.html
    http://www.breastfeed-essentials.com/gvstains.html
    Dr. Newman's candida protocol:
    http://www.kellymom.com/newman/c-candida_protocol.html
    And the best yeast article out there (IMHO, of course):
    http://www.lalecheleague.org/llleade...tNov98p91.html

  7. #7
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    Default Re: Stubborn Thrush?

    Quote Originally Posted by madeline View Post
    I have been calling the local pharmacies for gentian violet, and nobody has it in stock. I'm looking online at amazon.com and they have a 1% or a 2% solution in 10% alcohol? Does this sound right? Any suggestions on whether I should get the 1% or 2%? I am thinking 2% because it is stronger, but have read that it can cause ulcers in LO's mouth, so I'm not sure if stronger is better?

    Also, should I ask for another prescription for nystatin and use it at the same time? Has anyone used them both together?

    I really hope we can kick this thrush... the poor baby is going through so much -she has RSV right now (after one week at daycare!).
    I pump at work, twice each day, and I can't sterilize the pump parts. I just wipe them down with medela antimicrobial wipes and put them in the fridge. They get sterilized daily at home. Do you think this is enough? We have a microwave sterilizer. I just feel so desperate to get rid of the thrush!

    When we do get rid of it, any suggestions on how to keep it from coming back? Thanks so much!
    I didn't use them both at the same time. It might be too much for your lo, but I don't know. I only gave the gv to my lo for four days at a time with 3 days off inbetween bc I read it could be hard on them.

    I got my gv at Wal Mart for like 2 bucks- do you have one nearby?

    I pumped at work and only sterilized when I got home and that worked just fine for us. Don't save the milk for a long time, though. Give it the next day at the latest because the yeast can be in the milk and you don't want to reinfect later.

    Tips for keeping it away:
    wash your bras regularly
    wash your hands after going to the bathroom
    avoid antibiotics when possible (this is what got us twice!)
    eat yogurt or take a probiotic supplement or drink sweet acidopholus milk
    avoid sugars and simple carbs

    Good luck! It can be done, I battled it on and off for about 4 months and haven't dealt with it again in 7-8 months, now!!
    “We are not put on earth for ourselves, but are placed here for each other. If you are there always for others, then in time of need, someone will be there for you.”
    --Anonymous

  8. #8
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    Feb 2007
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    Default Re: Stubborn Thrush?

    My son got thrush somehow, he wasn't sick, and I was not taking an antibiotic or anything, but he still got it. Its gone now after 2 treatments of nystatin and some gentian violet. The weird thing about it, is DH has it now..its NASTY!!! its on his uvula the hangey thing in the back of his throat and down in his throat. Dont know how DH got it but he did just the same. He's now taking Magic Mouthwash 3 X day. Makes him grumpy

    My heart does go out to you and it can only get better

  9. #9
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    Aug 2007
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    72

    Default Re: Stubborn Thrush?

    Thanks so much. I am going to look at Walmart tomorrow for the GV. Otherwise, I will just order online. It seems a shame, since it will be $17 online!

    DH was asking me if he could get it... Good to know that he can, but now he'll prolly just start being a baby about it, asking me to look in his mouth all the time.

    Scary how it spreads like that. I hope we can really get rid of it. I'm going to be paranoid about it being all over the house, now. Thanks again for the replies!

  10. #10
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    Default Re: Stubborn Thrush?

    Quote Originally Posted by madeline View Post
    I'm going to be paranoid about it being all over the house, now.
    That is a good thing! It'll help you get rid of it. I've heard that people with persistant thrush problems had to constantly bathe their pets and clear up all the people in the household. Fortunately we don't have any pets and this is our first baby, but it's something to think about for others.
    “We are not put on earth for ourselves, but are placed here for each other. If you are there always for others, then in time of need, someone will be there for you.”
    --Anonymous

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