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Thread: any experience with Babywise?

  1. #11
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
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    789

    Default Re: any experience with Babywise?

    You use the word "routine" and I think that's the right word. You can start to lay the groundwork for a routine but I truly think it's easiest to let your baby lead the way. If your baby is only 4 weeks then you should give yourself *at least* 2 more months before worrying about a routine. They change so much and so fast!

    As for your snacker, mine has been that way since week 3 and I quickly learned I can't change him. He eats for 3-5 minutes and then is DONE, no matter how much I try to get him to eat more. Why fight? Why make him cry more than he already is going to? As long as your baby is gaining weight she's getting enough milk. Here how I look at it. My baby nurses for 5 minutes every two hours, including at night so that's 12 feedings and a total of 60 minutes I spend nursing each day. I have a friend who feeds her daughter every 3 hours and nurses for 15-20 minutes. So that's 120-160 minutes worth of nursing assuming it's about 8 feedings. I'd much rather nurse only 1 hour per day than 2 or more!!! Sometimes these "snacks" are a "full feeding" if your baby is very efficient at getting the milk out. Good luck!

    Anne- Mom to two active boys: Henry 10/06 and Jamie 4/09


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  2. #12

    Default Re: any experience with Babywise?

    You have a new baby and want to do the best that you can as her mom How, when, why and how much are all normal questions and concerns. LLL does not support any type of baby scheduling for eating or sleeping. That said if you follow your babies cues you will see that after time she will develop her own routine, many will wake in the am, be awake for a short period and then nap, eat, be awake, nap ect all day. No "ezzoing" has to be done. Also, as the pp said many many moms do have problems with their milk supply and also some FTT for some children has also been an issue. Many babies like my own are small and bc breast milk digests in about an 1.5 hours it is unrealistic to ask them to wait 3 or hours in between a feed. LLL believes that mothering through breastfeeding is the most natural way to mother. Many mothers, nurse on cue when their baby is hungry, tired, bored ect... Dr. Sears says that you should always respond to your baby in the beginning right away and then as they grow you will know when it is ok to make them wait a bit... Follow your heart, listen to your intuition and you will do a great job! Remember to look with in and not to a book for what is right for you and your family! Something that I personally have issues with in concerns to the book is that it teaches you to look at the schedule to see why your baby is crying and to go to the book and not follow your heart when it comes to your parenting descions
    Just re-emphasizing what Brittan had to say! She said it all for me.

    Jen
    "Mothers are designed to be available to their babies--to help them make the transition into this big, wide world. To teach them to trust, and love, and feel good about being alive."
    --Elizabeth N. Baldwin, Esq., So I Nursed Him Every 45 Minutes

    Click here to find your local LLL Group
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  3. #13
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Location
    Bryan, Texas
    Posts
    4,260

    Default Re: any experience with Babywise?

    Don't have time to post a whole lot, but I will say that as a FORMER "babywiser", I'd say that you really need to listen to your heart. I am surrounded by the philosophy, the book was a baby shower gift to me, and all the parents I know put that in to practice. So that's what we decided we'd do.

    Then enter my high-needs baby. In the beginning there was absolutely no problem with him eating every 3 hours. He was happy to go that long btwn feedings...probably because he had a pacifier in constantly and I was missing his cues. It saddens me what I put my baby through before finding this website and the friends here. Our BFing relationship might be totally different if I would have allowed him to nurse for comfort. The only saving grace is that my child is resilient and seems to have forgiven me....he REALLY loves co-sleeping, even though we just started at 10 months!

    Listen to your heart...that is the most important thing. DS is on a schedule, sort of. His own schedule. He usually naps at the same time, pretty consistently nurses at the same time, and eats solids at the same time...but always with the knowledge that these "times" can change from day to day according to his unique needs.

    HERE is a site that voices several concerns about babywise.


    PM with any questions you might have.

    Leslie
    All over the world there exists in every society a small group of women who feel themselves strongly attracted to giving care to other women during pregnancy and childbirth. Failure to make use of this group of highly motivated people is regrettable and a sin against the principle of subsidiary. ~ Dr. Kloosterman, Chief of OB/GYN, Univ. of Amsterdam, Holland


    **Leslie**

    Mama to:
    Shiloh (5/6/06) Nursed for 13 months and Josephine (7/26/08) Nursed for 23.5 mos Currently nursing my new little firecracker, Finley Catherine, born on the 4th of July!!

  4. #14
    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Posts
    2,467

    Default Re: any experience with Babywise?

    First let me say, I like some of what he has to say in the book. I do believe that parents have to lay the foundation and lead and teach the way. I have a hard time with baby-led anything. Now, I tried the scheduling at first with my LO because of in-laws accusing me of starving my baby to begin with. I was desperate and a friend gave me the book. I have to admit that I'm sure I missed his hunger cues when he was a little one. I'm ashamed to say that. It has since been rectified. The book does say to watch for hunger signs and feed if necessary, it does not say to hold out even if the child is displaying signs of hunger. Anyway, all in all the book is not for me, however, I have a friend that has a 5th one on the way and she is very scheduled. She follows the book, nurses, homeschools, attends church, and all in all is one of the most organized moms I have ever seen. Her children are well balanced, well mannered and happy go lucky. I guess my point is, whatever works for you. As long as your child is being fed and cared for, it's not for anyone else to say if it's right or wrong. Follow your heart. Feed your LO when she's hungry. I wish you all the best.

  5. #15
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Posts
    470

    Default Re: any experience with Babywise?

    This is a book that stirs up quite extreme reactions! Just read the reviews of this book on amazon.com and you will find about half the reviewers rave about how they have been helped, while the other half abhor it!

    I've read the earlier version of Gary Ezzo's book and there's a lot of it that is just plain common sense. But I must say, I found the tone of the writing a little authoritarian.

    Very simply, he recommends a basic principle for routines: eat, wake/play, nap, and repeat as often as is needed. Ezzo does not discourage feeding on cue. Rather, he recommends that parents should not use feeding as the answer to every one of baby's cries.

    But like all the other pp said, you need to adjust whatever you read to the needs of your baby.

    I fed my baby on demand and kept a simple log of his eating and napping. I noticed my baby fell into a routine sometime in the 3rd month, as far as napping goes. And when I realised that by adding one more feeding just before naptime, helped my baby to sleep better, I changed his routine to: eat, wake/play, top-up feed, nap. Also, found that baby needed to cluster feed in the afternoons. So that was built-in to our routine as well.

    HTH.

    Here's the other website where you can read some background on the Ezzos. http://www.ezzotruth.com I've found the other website (ezzoinfo) to be tendencious, biased and to have contained errors.
    Last edited by dorothy; March 26th, 2007 at 09:17 AM.
    Caylen Koen Chew (25/05/06)
    Lost No.2 in Aug 2008 ... Lost No. 3 in May 2009 Hoping for another ... Enjoying No.1



  6. #16
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Posts
    18

    Default Re: any experience with Babywise?

    Quote Originally Posted by home executive View Post
    This book is SO not middle ground. IMHO, it's best place is not on the bookshelf but in the garbage can. Sorry to be so blunt, but that is how I feel. The Ezzo philosophy just does not mesh well with breastfeeding, and I have seen it destroy many a breastfeeding relationship (and even scarier, the method has led to failure to thrive in some babies ).

    I didn't know how old your baby was, so I just read your other message. Your baby is only 4 weeks old. I'm sure it seems like there is no rhyme or reason to your dd's schedule, but that will change as she grows.

    In your other post, you mentioned that you were experiencing overactive letdown. How is that going now?

    You would like your baby to eat more at a time and go longer between feedings, but I don't know how often she is feeding now, or what your day looks like. Ideally, what are your goals? What would you like to see happen?
    In response....thank you for your posting!
    Yes there is no rhyme or reason for this baby! I personally am not a person of routine, but I have read that some routine is good for babies....

    The hyper letdown is not being too much of a problem. She sputters a bit sometimes, and we make a mess all over, but I just let some milk squirt itself out untill it slows down a bit just because she can't latch while my nipple is all slippery and gushing! My issues with her nursing habits have more to do with concerns over her getting enough of the good hindmilk than how often she eats really. She will just take about 3 minutes on one boob sometimes, and want to eat again after an hour and a half or so, but only take like 3 minutes again! I want to stretch the time so she will take more each time. And no amount of undressing/burping/diaperchanging/stimulus will convince her to take more when she gets into a snacking pattern. We go in tomorrow for her one month checkup, so I will know how well she is gaining. She was back to birth weight at one week, and she seems to be filling out and outgrowing her first outfits, and her diaper habits are very healthy.

    I pump sometimes to build my stash in the freezer, and I get about 3oz from one side, and I checked a few times and pumped right after she decided she was done, and got almos the same! So, I just want her to take a more complete feeding. I let her set her schedule at night, and she will sometimes go three hours on her own, but most of the time she gets started in a snacky pattern before morning comes, and we are nursing every half hour untill 2pm. Honestly, that will make me crazy! so yesterday I tried encouraging her to take a little more time between, and she actually went with it and seemed satisfied. She also seems ok with the ezzo approach of eat/wake/sleep. Today we are trying to make it at least 2 1/2 hours between the start of each feeding, but I don't let her go crazy for food if she is hungry.

    Thank you all for your input. I feel good about guiding her schedule without being legalistic.... I appreciate the encouragement

  7. #17
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Posts
    9,280

    Default Re: any experience with Babywise?

    Krystle!

    I'm in Tacoma. We just moved here from Puyallup. ITA with the other posters. I've seen BabyWise work great for some moms, but most of them were formula feeders. Have you read the BabyWhisperer? Its a little like BabyWise but a little gentler....no crying, etc. It works well for some. I do think that any book MUST be tweaked to conform to breastfeeding. Y'know? The way I see it, how can we know if baby is hungry, thirsty, just a little hungry, etc? How would I feel if someone said to me, "No you cannot have a drink to quench your thirst." Thats how I try to remember my DS's needs.

    I too have a really hard time letting my day flow by loosely. Daniel is such a snacker, I felt like a schedule would actually reassure me that he was eating enough. But I stopped worrying about that, and just made sure his diaper output was good. I stopped watching the clock. This was so hard for me, as I was always planning, writing lists etc. We don't "schedule" feedings. But I do follow a nap routine. I always offer nursing when he wakes up, and when he goes to sleep, and frequently during his awake time. But he seems to only really nurse when he wakes from a nap and right before bed for the night. Thats kind of the pattern we fell into. Nursing does not put him to sleep, it totally energizes him. So we go with it. Just having this loose sleep routine helps me feel a little more in control of the day but also offers him the breast whenever he wants.

    I was helped greatly by this site, and I hope you will be too.

    Lyn
    Last edited by @llli*danlynclark; March 26th, 2007 at 07:32 PM.
    Lyn
    Nursing the girl with kaleidoscope eyes


    Mama to Daniel (12/3/06) and Lucy Jane (8/28/08)

  8. #18
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Posts
    561

    Default Re: any experience with Babywise?

    KrystleDawn wrote: "My issues with her nursing habits have more to do with concerns over her getting enough of the good hindmilk than how often she eats really. She will just take about 3 minutes on one boob sometimes, and want to eat again after an hour and a half or so, but only take like 3 minutes again! I want to stretch the time so she will take more each time. And no amount of undressing/burping/diaperchanging/stimulus will convince her to take more when she gets into a snacking pattern.

    My DD1 was a snacker, and I had the same concern about foremilk/hindmilk imbalance that you do. I was advised that if I fed DD from 1 breast and she wanted to nurse again within 2 hours, use the same breast. After 2 hours had elapsed from the feeding on the one breast, switch to the other. That seemed to help me. (What showed me that she was getting too much foremilk was the "green poop" that often results from a foremilk/hindmilk imbalance.)

    As for keeping up the frequent nursing, it does not last long. Potential consequences of weaning to formula, though, like juvenile diabetes, asthma and other allergies, and others listed on the American Academy of Pediatrics' web site, can last a long time and be a real pain to deal with.

    Speaking of the AAP, I think they were investigating Ezzo's parent-directed feeding methods for causing failure to thrive.

    I'm glad you found this forum and hope you'll stay. Try to find a local LLL group too; you will receive valuable information and companionship! HTH.

  9. #19
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Location
    Charleston SC
    Posts
    2,601

    Default Re: any experience with Babywise?

    You are right about the AAP and the Ezzos, I think that there are three statements out advising AGAINST the Babywise method.....makes you wonder.... ( let me also say that the Ezzos actually go to our church here in Charleston, they are lovely people, just uninformed about feeding babies, esp breastfed babies

  10. #20
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Posts
    10,440

    Default Re: any experience with Babywise?

    Quote Originally Posted by Brittan View Post
    Y just uninformed about feeding babies, esp breastfed babies
    I think this is very true.

    A friend of mine loves Babywise and does it with all her babies. But, every time, she has a supply issue, the babies fail to thrive even though they are good-sized at birth, and she ends up weaning early.

    IMHO, it's because she never gives her body and baby a chance to "get together" to build a good supply as she gets so focused on the "schedule" that she ignores when the baby might be hungry between times -- like during a growth spurt .

    But she's not as pro-BFing as she is pro-sleep, so she gives up nursing for rest. That's her choice, but she and I have had to agree to disagree on that

    She convinced me to read it, particularly after she heard my first was high-needs, and we implemented a few ideas, but I didn't think it helped at all. In fact, it just made high-needs guy worse. So we went back to parenting by our hearts with support from like-minded parents.

    Like ALL parenting advice, you take what works and fits with your family and ignore the rest, which there will be lots of
    Susan
    Mama to my all-natural boys: Ian, 9-4-04, 11.5 lbs; Colton, 11-7-06, 9 lbs, in the water; Logan, 12-8-08, 9 lbs; Gavin, 1-18-11, 9 lbs; and an angel 1-15-06
    18+ months and for Gavin, born with an incomplete cleft lip and incomplete posterior cleft palate
    Sealed for time and eternity, 7-7-93
    Always babywearing, cosleeping and cloth diapering. Living with oppositional defiant disorder and ADHD. Ask me about cloth diapering and sewing your own diapers!

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