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Thread: first poop?

  1. #31
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
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    San Diego
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    259

    Default Re: first poop?

    ok, well I guess i was feeling relieved a little too soon. took DS back to doc today for his circumcision and he's lost weight since last saturday. Since he was born, his weight has been:
    8/14- 1231am- 10lb 11oz
    8/14- 12pm- 10lb 5oz
    8/17- 10lb 5oz
    8/18- 9lb 14oz
    8/22- 9lb 13oz (after fasting for almost 2 hours)

    *I should note that all the weights were taken on different scales...

    And, to date, we have only had one large poop... bigger than what babies this age typically have. So, doc says he isn't too worried about his health, but that he'd feel better if he was gaining weight and pooping. His pee diapers continue to be full and frequent. So, I don't know what I"m doing wrong. Doc says i need to supplement with 1.5oz and every other feeding. He seems to think DS isn't getting enough of the fatty milk. I feel so defeated and deflated... i have no idea what to do. Right now, I nurse as often and as long as DS wants. I only switch sides once he unlatches from the first. I don't ever get engorged or feel full, so I'm not sure if he's completely drained one side before I move him on to the other side. But, it's usually after at least 10-20 minutes that I switch him. During the day he nurses at least every two hours (though today he's especially sleepy because of hte circumcision), and at night i feed him at least every three hours. I'm going to start pumping after each session, so I can supplement at the next session. What else do I have to do?

    After I had DD, i struggled with breastfeeding and ended up nursing AND pumping for 9 months while supplementing with formula. I can't do that again. Now that I have two kids, I can't do the nurse/pump/supplement thing... it was a full time job. I really want this nursing thing to happen...but sometimes i feel as though it's one disappointment after another, and I don't know if Ihave the emotional reserves to keep going through this.
    Last edited by @llli*alilwest; August 22nd, 2012 at 08:12 PM.

  2. #32

    Default Re: first poop?

    if you do not want to supplement with formula, but want to supplement, i would suggest ask dr. if you can pump your own milk and supplement with that.
    I would also suggest, find a way to have baby weighed on the same accurate baby scale at least two consecutive times a few days apart to see if weight is starting to increase.

    you could also- see an ibclc for before after nursing weight checks. Also, if latch is still painful that could indicate a poor latch that could also lead to poor milk transfer.
    all breastmilk has fat is it. and an overload of the less fatty 'foremilk' due to forceful letdown would typically cause a baby to poop more, not less. Typically, babies don't gain because they do not get enough milk, or there is an underlying medical issue.

  3. #33
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
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    San Diego
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    Default Re: first poop?

    he said i could supplement with breastmilk, but i don't have an extra 1.5 for every other feeding to supplement with. There's another support group tomorrow at the hospital... that is the only place i may have access to the same scale for consecutive weigh-ins.

    Latch is no longer painful. Our IBCLC helped us figure that out. And, I don't think I have a forceful let down... he doesn't really have any of the other signs of forceful letdown. I guess he just isn't getting enough.

  4. #34

    Default Re: first poop?

    OK, baby is currently 8 days old-right? I wonder if it is just a little early for so much concern, esp since, as i understand it, your baby is peeing as expected, pooped a ton in the first day of life, and has had one giant poop since, was a very big baby to begin with, and has never had an accurate weight gain check. Different scales may make no difference of course, but they can make a huge difference-and there is no way to know what the situation is in this case.

    Moms do not start out making a ton of milk-nor do babies need much early on. Very dramatically in this first week, and going forward for the next several weeks, milk supply is building from almost nothing to, by about 6 weeks, full milk production. According to the breastfeeding text Breastfeeding Answers Made Simple, (Mohrbacher, 2010) “With frequent breastfeeding, by the end of the first week, a mothers milk production has increased more than ten-fold-from an average of a little more than 1 ounce per day total on the first day to about 10-19 ounces per day by day 7. During this same time, the babies stomach expands and can comfortably hold about 1-2 ounces of milk at a feeding.”

    It goes on to say that in the 2nd and third weeks, with frequent feeding, a baby can hold from 2-3 ounces per feeding and takes about 20-25 ounces of milk per day.

    So at this point, your baby would NORMALLY be taking anywhere from a little more than 10 to a little more than 20 ounces per day.

    an ounce and a half every other feeding, assuming baby nurses at least 10 times a day, would be a total supplement of 7.5 ounces daily. That would be from about a half to a third of your baby’s total needed daily intake coming from supplements. This would in turn mean your breasts are losing that much stimulation and you would thus need to pump every time you supplemented, or your milk supply will be affected.

    On the other hand, you could get a similar ounce total 'extra' into baby by nursing about 3-4 more times a day, assuming you are producing milk normally and the issue is not low supply.

    You had some breastfeeding issues indicated by the painful latch that may have affected milk transfer, and that may have affected weight gain and even, temporarily, milk production. But if those are fixed and latch is comfortable, baby may well get enough now by nursing frequently, which will in turn also increase your milk production.

    You are there with your baby and you know best. Supplementing does not mean the end of breastfeeding, and of course if your baby is truly not able to get enough milk via breastfeeding, it is totally appropriate and needed to supplement. if you supplement, there are ways to do so that are more 'breastfeeding friendly"

    But you may want to consider-how often is baby nursing-a minimum of 12 times in 24 hours? could you increase nursing frequency? How long will baby nurse for?

    is baby actively sucking and swallowing while nursing, do your breasts feel any less ‘full’ after baby nurses, or seem to feel any fuller or heavier between feedings? does baby seem satisfied after nursing-for even a short time? those would be indications of normal milk production/baby getting enough. On the other hand, does baby seem overly sleepy or lethargic, ( not waking regularly to nurse?) or is baby frantic, tense or 'worried' when nursing or after? that would possibly indicate baby not getting enough.

  5. #35
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    Jan 2011
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    San Diego
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    Default Re: first poop?

    Right now i plan on pumping following my nursing sessions and giving DS that milk during the next feeding using the SNS.

    He is sleeping almost all of the time. He does have his quiet alert times, too, but he sleeps almost constantly. He falls asleep at the breast almost every feeding. To try to keep him up I will burp him, do breast compressions, rub his head.... and usually he'll wake up, but will comfort nurse. Up until last night, he would wake up on his own to feed. Last night i had to wake him up each time to eat.. once after 4hrs, and the other after 3. I'm obviously not going to let him go that long tonight without eating. But, he's super tired today because of hte circumcision.

    i stopped keeping track of the feedings, but i would say its at least 12x per day. i'll start logging again. He'll nurse for a good 15-20 min on each side, then comfort nurse for a while longer. my breasts dont really ever feel full, so i cant feel them to determine if hes consumed enough. I know it's a supply and demand thing, but i always feel like when i feed or pump more that there will be less... I never feel like my supply will catch up with the demand. but, having said that, I still plan on feeding him more frequently. probably every 2-2.5 hours at night and every 1.5-2 hours during the day.... or more frequently if he's hungry. He has had a few cluster type eating sessions, but besides those, he does seem to be content after eating.

  6. #36
    Join Date
    May 2006
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    19,923

    Default Re: first poop?

    I don't at all want to add to your workload, but one thing you can do is to rent a professional scale and do before-and-after feeding weights at home. If you're having trouble gauging how much milk your LO is taking in at the breast, a scale can really help with that. You'll know when you need to supplement, and when you don't. It can also help you gauge weight gain on a day-to-day basis- not that a baby must gain weight every single day, but often they do and it shows up in the scale. And if a baby goes several days without gaining, that shows up, too.
    Coolest thing my big girl said recently: "How can you tell the world is moving when you are standing on it?"
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  7. #37

    Default Re: first poop?

    Sorry if this sounds like I am contradicting myself, but its just so hard to pinpoint this stuff...., but if your baby is nursing very frequently and well, it may be normal to not feel full-and uncomfortably full is something moms want to avoid, in fact...and of course babies this age DO normally sleep a ton, basically they sleep and eat, and sometimes eat while they sleep, its a tad early to worry about quiet alert times that do not involve eating. but you are absolutely right to wake baby if baby is not nursing frequently enough- at least 12 times a day.
    You are doing amazing-nursing often, pumping extra, supplementing with an sns, I know this is exhausting but these are all things that will help-but make sure to take care of your own health too.... I feel like you are kind of struggling alone- and what I really would like to see is some more proactive assistance locally. What does your IBCLC say about supplementing? Did she mention doing a before and after nursing weight check (or a series of them-the more you do, the more clear the picture will be.) Also, do you have a local LLL meeting or Leader to contact?

    I agree with mommal, if you cannot weigh baby accurately otherwise, or do before and after nursing weight checks any other way, renting your own scale may be helpful...I usually don't suggest this as it can cause scale/weigh in obsession, but in this case, I think it would really help you to have some clarity about what is actually happening milk transfer and weight gain-wise.

    I am not sure what the transfer you would expect to see at this age would be. AFTER 2 weeks of age, according to Breastfeeding Answers Made Simple, it is expected baby will transfer about 2 ounces or more per nursing session. At this point, a bit less than that may well be entirely normal. maybe ask your IBCLC.

  8. #38
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Location
    San Diego
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    Default Re: first poop?

    I'm looking into renting a scale, though fear it will make me a bigger stress case.

    Also, I had a quick question for you all... I tried to stimulate my son today using the thermometer, with vaseline, to see if we could get another BM, and I found that it was extremely difficult to even get the thermometer in there. It's the same type of rectal thermometer I use on my daughter, though I didn't use it on her until she was older. Could that mean that there is something wrong physically? I'm not sure if it's supposed to be that small.... ok, nevermind... sorry, totally worrying about nothing.....
    Last edited by @llli*alilwest; August 23rd, 2012 at 11:01 PM.

  9. #39

    Default Re: first poop?

    Normal to worry momma- just try not to stress too much-there is some explanation(s) for what is going on, its just a matter of finding it...sometimes detective is one of the many hats moms must wear.

  10. #40
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Location
    San Diego
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    Default Re: first poop?

    I've finally thrown in the towel.

    We still have had only one poop since we left he hospital over a week ago. Also, after supplementing with formula, it's become apparent that the "full" wet diapers I thought we were getting weren't full at all. He's not gaining weight. He isn't thriving. I feel like I really tried. I thought I did my homework. I thought I did what I was supposed to do. I have been attached to either a baby or a pump for the last few days and it didn't help. At all. I had an iBCLC come and help me. I thought we had our latch down. I fed him at least 12 x per day, whenever he wanted for as long as he wanted. I don't understand. The guilt is overwhelming, but I can't watch him not thrive anymore. I'm going to pump for comfort until I dry up, and eventually just feed him formula. I hate it. I feel like such a failure. It's not fair knowing that you want to do what's right, but can't. You try to do what you're supposed to do, but you can't.

    Anyways, thank you ladies for your help. Despite how this ended, I appreciate your help and time.

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