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Thread: Lost Weight?

  1. #1
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Posts
    20

    Unhappy Lost Weight?

    Howdy, again.

    I've posted a few times, about our son falling asleep on my wife while breastfeeding (but also seemingly breastfeeding constantly), and also about how our pediatrician said he was having "starvation stools" and to feed him formula after feeding him for 20 minutes from the breast.

    Anyway. We've been back and forth from IBCLCs, and we thought things were looking good again. We had a few scares along the way, and last week we were definitely giving him some bottles of formula (additionally, my DS had his HepB vaccine last week, and before the shot my wife fed him some formula so he'd be calm, as he still takes about 60-90 minutes to 'complete a feeding' (although I've rarely seen him actually complete the feeding)). When we weighed him last week, he was weighed at 3580 grams. This represented a 30gr/day gain from the previous time (same scale) and we were quite happy about that. Although the nurse mentioned he was in a very low percentile (between 3rd and 5th), she mentioned his gain has been in line with the curve.

    Anyway. Our LO is now 6 weeks old. We've tried to stop the formula completely. My wife went to an IBCLC on Sunday. She fed him from her "good side" (she has one 'good side' and one side with plugged ducts that she's trying to work out) for 30 minutes and our son got 70 ccs of milk (based on pre/post weights). She tried to complete the feed from her other side (to give it stimulation and to get rid of the plug), so he probably gained a bit more (but he did pee/poop and was changed after the first side, so we didn't know exactly how much).

    We thought everything was on the up and up. This morning, our DS pooped twice and peed. We brought him to be weighed again this morning, and he was weighed at 3500 grams. This represents an 80 gram loss over 4-5 days. We were devastated, especially because we thought everything was going well. The nurse said, "Look, you fed him formula before last time, and this time you told me he pooped and peed. I don't think he actually lost all 80 grams - just by looking at him." And, sure, I agree, but he definitely didn't gain as much as he should have - and he probably even lost.

    We're pulling our hair out -- my wife feeds our DS constantly. We really, really thought he was getting better. I've been hearing him swallow, I've been seeing soiled and wet diapers... and then I was hit with a weight loss. What should we do? Should we keep pushing ahead? Should we supplement? I'm afraid if we reintroduce a bottle, his sucking will get lazy again - right when we believe it's getting better. Should we wait? At what point should we get nervous?

    Are we doing the right thing???

    Thanks again for all your kind words and advice...

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Posts
    10,440

    Default Re: Lost Weight?

    Was it the same scale?

    The poop and pee can be quite a lot.

    I don't know if I would be too upset. I might go back and check again in a few days. And I don't think I'd jump right to supplements or call it quits. Baby sounds like he is doing well.

    Instead of bottles, if baby needs a supplement, try an SNS. Then baby gets his supplement but mom gets stimulation.

    Has anybody checked this kid for tongue tie or a submucosal cleft palate? That is a long, long time for a baby of that age to take. Still within the range of normal, but usually, around 6-7 weeks, they start speeding it up a bit in the mornings at least.
    Susan
    Mama to my all-natural boys: Ian, 9-4-04, 11.5 lbs; Colton, 11-7-06, 9 lbs, in the water; Logan, 12-8-08, 9 lbs; Gavin, 1-18-11, 9 lbs; and an angel 1-15-06
    18+ months and for Gavin, born with an incomplete cleft lip and incomplete posterior cleft palate
    Sealed for time and eternity, 7-7-93
    Always babywearing, cosleeping and cloth diapering. Living with oppositional defiant disorder and ADHD. Ask me about cloth diapering and sewing your own diapers!

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Posts
    20

    Default Re: Lost Weight?

    It was the same scale between the 3580 and the 3500.

    Our son was checked for being tongue-tied, and they said he was fine. Not sure about the other (i.e. cleft palate).

    Like I said, I think his feedings have started getting shorter. If not, then I think we have a problem. He just hit the 6 week mark today. I know things are supposed to start getting easier, and I think they might be. Which is why I'm trying to hold off on the supplements as long as he's peeing and pooping. And also, when we went to the IBCLC, he had gotten about 70cc (~2.5oz, a smidge less) in 27 minutes (based on pre/post weighings). So that's also why I think it's getting better -- but I really don't know. Yesterday he was fussy throughout the early afternoon (12-4), then he slept for about an hour and a half nap, then ate again at pretty regular intervals until we went to sleep. He usually gives us 2-3 hour stretches at night.

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Posts
    10,440

    Default Re: Lost Weight?

    OK, then it does sound just fine Really. It's hard to not worry when this is your first baby!

    Fussy is often simply a sign that baby is overwhelmed at that age, if baby has free access to nursing. Babies are quickly overwhelmed by life, so they fuss to block it out. Tuck baby in a sling and nurse and rock.

    I would ask about the submucosal cleft palate, just to be sure. There was a mama here a few months back who had a baby who had a very difficult time nursing, and when her baby was a couple months old, it was discovered he had a very small cleft of the soft palate, and there was another mom who had a baby who was not gaining well at all, and that baby had a submucosal cleft.
    Susan
    Mama to my all-natural boys: Ian, 9-4-04, 11.5 lbs; Colton, 11-7-06, 9 lbs, in the water; Logan, 12-8-08, 9 lbs; Gavin, 1-18-11, 9 lbs; and an angel 1-15-06
    18+ months and for Gavin, born with an incomplete cleft lip and incomplete posterior cleft palate
    Sealed for time and eternity, 7-7-93
    Always babywearing, cosleeping and cloth diapering. Living with oppositional defiant disorder and ADHD. Ask me about cloth diapering and sewing your own diapers!

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Posts
    20

    Default Re: Lost Weight?

    He's definitely had free access to nursing; my wife is the the non-stop milk bar.

    I'm just concerned that he's only able to get to the easily accessible milk, and so he gets filled when he nurses in the mornings, but in the afternoons and evenings he doesn't.
    I guess we'll keep on keeping on for now, as long as he's outputting diapers - and we'll have him weighed again next week.

    It's hard not to be nervous, though. His weight gains have always been low, he's small, and we never know how much he's getting. Compound that with the fact that he's basically been nursing round the clock without any breaks for the past few weeks and it's easy to think that he's being underfed... :-\

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
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    10,440

    Default Re: Lost Weight?

    Does she use breast compressions? That can wake up a sleepy baby and help baby get more milk.

    And if baby just nursed on one side, switch sides, back and forth, and then baby gets more hindmilk. But if he's constantly nursing (which, contrary to popular belief, is NORMAL), he is getting plenty of hindmilk, particularly if his stools are normal in color and consistency for a breastfed baby.

    Even a baby fed BM via bottle eats all the time. I spent the first 3 months of my fourth baby's life hooked to a pump and with his cleft feeder in my hand. Non-stop. It's much easier to just nurse through those.

    If weight becomes a real issue, consider double cream bottles instead of formula. I did those for a few days when it was thought my cleft baby was going to have some weight problems (very typical for cleft babies), and it got the doctors off my back, we settled into a routine, and we never looked back.

    And regarding the size...everyone thinks bigger is better. Some children are just smaller than others. As long as they are consistent, that is what matters.
    Susan
    Mama to my all-natural boys: Ian, 9-4-04, 11.5 lbs; Colton, 11-7-06, 9 lbs, in the water; Logan, 12-8-08, 9 lbs; Gavin, 1-18-11, 9 lbs; and an angel 1-15-06
    18+ months and for Gavin, born with an incomplete cleft lip and incomplete posterior cleft palate
    Sealed for time and eternity, 7-7-93
    Always babywearing, cosleeping and cloth diapering. Living with oppositional defiant disorder and ADHD. Ask me about cloth diapering and sewing your own diapers!

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Posts
    20

    Default Re: Lost Weight?

    Oh yeah - she's been using compressions. We watched the Dr. Newman videos!

    We also found that the football hold helps a sleepy baby, and also makes it easier for him as my wife has a large chest. Of course, the football hold isn't the most comfortable for her, especially at night when it's much easier for her to roll on her side and give our LO the breast while she dozes...

    I'm not sure what you mean by "double cream" bottles?

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Location
    Northern Cal.
    Posts
    4,983

    Default Re: Lost Weight?

    with Susan here. Honestly, it sounds like he's doing well! I know it's hard, especially when you've had a scare - it would make anyone jumpy.

    Susan will jump back in to talk about double cream bottles. I think she would skim the cream off one bottle and put it in a second bottle for extra fat? She'll explain.

    With such long nursing sessions, I'd frankly be amazed if he's not getting lots of fatty hindmilk. The easily accessible milk is long gone by the times you're talking about!

    Hang in there. Six weeks is the height of fussiness in most babies, so that's not really an indicator of a problem.


    You can call me JoMo!

    Mom to baby boy Joe, born 5/4/09 and breastfed for more than two and a half years, and baby girl Maggie, born 7/9/12.

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Posts
    20

    Default Re: Lost Weight?

    I've been at work all day, jumpy and fretting, and my wife and DS have been at home, so I don't know how it's been going today. I'll keep you all updated here - if only to retain my sanity, and so I can show my wife all the kind words of support and encouragement.

    Just to summarize, here have been the weights:
    9/2/2011 (Discharge from hospital): 2560
    9/13/2011: 2940
    9/20/2011: 3100
    10/6/2011: 3580
    10/11/2011: 3500

    (All weights in grams)

    Of course, like I said, that 3580 may have been inflated due to the extra formula supplementation, and the 3500 deflated due to the peeing/pooping immediately prior to weighing (and the complete removal of formula supplementation). That said, the difference should still have been to the upside, but we are trying to maintain a positive outlook!

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Posts
    10,440

    Default Re: Lost Weight?

    Double cream bottles are simply made. I would pump and let milk stand for a few hours. It would naturally separate into layers. The bottom is a bluish milk. Then it would get thicker looking as you get to the top. On the top is the cream. Take that for sure. I used a spoon or syringe to suck off a lot of that. Then add to another bottle of pumped milk. You can also take the thicker milk too, the milk right under the cream, probably the top half of the bottle, and use that too. Save the rest, as later it can be used to add to baby food, or mix it back in a bottle or sippy later.

    Do I think your baby needs these? No. To me, all sounds well. You can make yourself nuts watching a baby's weight. I am not saying ignore weight; I'm saying use it as one of many data points.
    Susan
    Mama to my all-natural boys: Ian, 9-4-04, 11.5 lbs; Colton, 11-7-06, 9 lbs, in the water; Logan, 12-8-08, 9 lbs; Gavin, 1-18-11, 9 lbs; and an angel 1-15-06
    18+ months and for Gavin, born with an incomplete cleft lip and incomplete posterior cleft palate
    Sealed for time and eternity, 7-7-93
    Always babywearing, cosleeping and cloth diapering. Living with oppositional defiant disorder and ADHD. Ask me about cloth diapering and sewing your own diapers!

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