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  • @llli*bettyb's Avatar
    Today, 02:38 AM
    Thank you so much for your reply, what great advice. A lot of what you are saying I have thought myself but it is nice to have someone else repeat it back to you and just to know someone else gets where I am coming from. I actually downloaded a copy of that book so will buy it now on your recommendation. I am not due for another few months so I do have time. As for support, we have very little to be honest. My husband will hopefully be off for the first 3 weeks. He is a massive support and totally on board with breastfeeding. That was another thing that really knocked my confidence last time, my extended family didn't support me when breastfeeding. Mainly I know because they don't understand it. It was like we were just being silly new parents trying to breastfeed so much so when our son wasn't putting on weight I had my MIL tell me to give him a bottle and her sister ringing me telling me how MIL was worried sick that he wasn't putting on weight and would we just give a bottle. We were really made feel like we were starving him! Of course in the height of everything with all these different opinions you don't know what to think, looking back (and my husband totally agrees and is so cross over it) it was unacceptable and we should have said something. But look that is something I have to get over too. I don't know could I ever change their opinions anyway so I think I just have to learn to ignore these comments. I do think I will be much more confident this...
    2 replies | 79 view(s)
  • @llli*maddieb's Avatar
    Yesterday, 11:57 PM
    Hi pinkmomof2. Yes it is certainly usually possible to get a baby back to the breast after bottle feeding. Of course you will need to get baby to latch better so you are not in pain or injured, that can take practice for both you and baby, and there are many positioning and latch techniques that help. It sounds like you have lots of breastfeeding support where you are so take advantage! Keep going to the LLL meetings and talking to Leaders on the phone. If you can see lactation consultants again, do that as well. Sometimes it takes time to get things back on track. Keep getting help and support! Actually, this very well could be at least part of the problem. If you are pumping 40-50 ounces of milk a day, that is almost enough for twins. This is called overproduction or OP for short. OP often leads to a secondary problem called fast or forceful letdown (FFLD for short) Many times OP causes no problems but other times it certainly can. For mom it makes her more likely to get plugs and/or mastitis. For baby, the problem is from the FFLD. All that milk coming all at once can basically panic baby, causing them to refuse to nurse. Also if baby DOES latch, the FFLD potentially causes baby to slip "down" the nipple (causing a shallow latch) and also causes baby to clamp down to try to stem the flow. The result could be latch pain and injured nipples.
    1 replies | 32 view(s)
  • @llli*pinkmomof2's Avatar
    Yesterday, 11:16 PM
    I really want to breastfeed again. I had to give up from the awful pain of mastitis over and over, cracked bleeding nipples that became a scab and chunks falling off. So painful I thought I would pass out. Horrible anxiety attacks and panic when I had to feed. So I ended up exclusively pumping and feeding baby the bottle. I pump about 40-50oz of milk a day. I tried latching baby on tonight (6 weeks tomorrow) and she screamed and pushed me away. I exclusively breastfed her till she was 3 weeks. I saw lac consultants and had her check for ties etc. Went to lll meeting, breastfeeding support to try to get less painful latch. Now I am healed and I would like to try breastfeeding again. Is it possible? She roots for nipple but once she latches she sucks it like a bottle then screams and spits it out while clawing at me. Milk is going everywhere so that's not the problem. Help!?? Or should I give up on the boob.
    1 replies | 32 view(s)
  • @llli*maddieb's Avatar
    Yesterday, 10:03 PM
    Hi. So sorry you are having this concern. I will try to offer some suggestions, but first I have some questions, hope that is ok. Aside the weight gain, how are other growth parameters? Were all weight checks on the same scale? this almost never happens, but if you could note when it was a different scale that would help. Were the scales always digital infant scales? Any reason to convert the numbers (from grams to ounces, for example.) Was the person doing the weight checks always focused and careful? Baby only in dry diaper or naked? That sounds normal, but do you have a lowest known weight? In other words, do we have any idea how much baby lost after being born? So if these checks were accurate, baby gained 18 ounces in 21 days. Am I right? That seems like normal gain. What is the pediatrician expecting gain to be?
    1 replies | 41 view(s)
  • @llli*maddieb's Avatar
    Yesterday, 09:42 PM
    The nice thing about the 8th edition of the WAB is it is set up so you can start wherever you are. If baby is still having trouble with latch, you can start with chapter 4: Latching and attaching. You can skip chapter 5 but even if baby is over 2 weeks read chapter 6 because it has so much valuable info about normal newborn behavior. Then Chapter 7 is for 2-6 weeks where I guess you are at this point? You can also use the index to find info on whatever you are concerned about. For example tongue tie is discussed in detail on pages 428-430. Chapters 17 and 18 are basically about how to problem solve when there are issues. There is also a good chapter on sleep, but one of the authors realized this was a subject that needed much more attention so she co-wrote another book called Sweet Sleep and I also highly recommend that book as well. I am very glad you have an LC you are confident in. That is great and it sounds like they identified the tt early and treated it and that is fantastic. Sometimes when LCs are also doctors (and even sometimes when they are not) they are unable to spend the time needed with mom and baby because try as we might, a baby is not always going to nurse when expected to and it can take time- sometimes a great deal of time- to troubleshoot a breastfeeding problem. There is nothing inherently better about an LC who is a doctor or a nurse because it is an entirely different skill set. In my opinion what is most important is that the LC has...
    5 replies | 99 view(s)
  • @llli*hannah.seed's Avatar
    Yesterday, 08:27 PM
    This is my fifth baby, and all have been on the lower end of the weight spectrum. My pediatricion has told me to supplement with formula for all of them. I listened to him the first time, and that made the situation go from what was probably fine to bad to worse, and he ended up being exclusively formula fed. With my twins and my last baby i didnt listen to him and just kept doing my best exclusively breastfeeding, but they all remained at the lowest number acceptable. (they are all miraculously fine btw) So at birth my newest baby weighed 5 lb 7 oz. He was exactly at his birth weight at 10 days. Three weeks after his 10 day checkup he weighed 6 lb 9 oz. It took him a full week to learn how to latch (two weeks early, knot in cord and wrapped around neck, weak for first week) and he still doesnt SEEM like he nurses that well. He has good output (5-6 wet, 1-2 poo) and is relatively happy besides being impossible to keep sleeping due to horrid reflux/vomiting. My ped isnt happy with his growth (as usual) but i dont know whether his concerns are valid or if my baby is fine though at the lower end of the weight chart. I nurse him whenever he wants... sometimes every hour (mornings and evenings) and sometimes he goes 3-4 (warm sleepy afternoons and nights). Some days i think he is feeding so good and other days im wondering if hes forgotten he needs milk to survive?? Can somebody just let me know if his weight is okay and if im doing okay breastfeeding (to you know, calm...
    1 replies | 41 view(s)
  • @llli*erc45's Avatar
    Yesterday, 06:59 PM
    Sorry for the confusion, baby did NOT nurse before formula, but was given breastmilk via bottle. So the green poops were with bottled breastmilk. The ONLY actual nursing we have done has been maybe 2-3x before this recent doctor visit (last Monday) and 2-3x this week (2-3 short nursing sessions that were more for comfort it seemed as they were b/w feedings and she seemed sleepy I worked with an IBCLC who is also a neonatologist, she is who performed the release and we saw her one other time to evaluate latch, but baby wasn't hungry so it wasn't a productive visit. I will definitely make an appt with her this week to re-eval latch and do weight check. Regarding the doctor, I guess my brain was just in overdrive and I was not convinced it was nothing, but am glad to hear reassurance that this just may be more normal than my gut is telling me. I am going to try a full nursing session later tonight and see how it goes. I really appreciate all of the other advice, I found that all very helpful and reassuring. I actually had started The Womanly Art of Breastfeeding, but it was at the very beginning and since baby wouldn't latch (she literally could not latch at ALL before the tongue tie release) I think I'd lost hope and stopped reading.
    5 replies | 99 view(s)
  • @llli*maddieb's Avatar
    Yesterday, 05:54 PM
    Ok, so did baby ever "just nurse?" I am sorry I am rather confused. I assumed that before the formula, baby was breastfed - nursing- and gaining fine but that was when you saw the green poops? Were the green poops rather while baby was being bottle fed your milk? Before the tongue tie treatment? After? If baby has never nursed exclusively, then it may be that baby cannot transfer milk normally, although it is unlikely. I would strongly suggest see an IBCLC and do some before and after nursing session weight checks. If your baby is capable of transferring 2 ounces or more in one nursing session, they can transfer milk normally. But you need to do more than one check because it is normal for baby to take less sometimes too. Here is info about what to expect at an appt with an IBCLC: http://cwgenna.com/lconsult.html Aside the question of whether baby can nurse normally or not, I think what may be happening is you are thinking entirely normal newborn behavior indicates something is wrong, and that is very common for new moms- and even many of us "old moms" when something out of our experience happens. However what surprised me was that the pediatrician's reassurance did not reassure you...I am certainly not someone who thinks doctors know everything, and I believe in mom's intuition...but what you are reporting as far as the poops and the behavior does not sound unusual to me in the least. I would suggest, as long as doctor says it is ok, and you want to, start...
    5 replies | 99 view(s)
  • @llli*erc45's Avatar
    Yesterday, 04:37 PM
    This is my first my first child so I definitely think a lot of my anxiety about what is normal is due to not having any experience. Her sleep actually has improved (no idea if due to change in diet or not), but there have been nights where she cries until 4,5, 6 a.m. For the past week or so she has slept 4-5 hour stretches. There are times where she seems very difficult to calm down and occasionally she wakes from deep sleep crying a very high pitched cry like she is in pain. My doctor said that usually mucous is in indicator or dairy intolerance (not an allergy), but she is growing well so he said i could try to cut dairy from my diet if I wanted to try that, but I already feel so stressed that I don't know if adding that stress would help or hurt (hence me wanting to do a trial of formula before I change my diet drastically). She had a tongue tie diagnosed at 2 weeks and her latch has only just improved since the release, but that has been a major source of anxiety for me. I've done only a few occasional nursing sessions during this trial phase this past week when nothing else would calm her where it seems like it is more for comfort for her than feeding so I have no idea how much milk she transfers. I guess my first time stressed out mommy brain desperately wants to fix her. I do have lots of friends with babies and I DO think she is more fussy than any of their babies, and I guess I am trying to connect the green mucous poops to her unusual fussiness. I guess...
    5 replies | 99 view(s)
  • @llli*jollycat's Avatar
    Yesterday, 02:09 PM
    Yes, that makes a lot of sense. Thank you!
    2 replies | 82 view(s)
  • @llli*maddieb's Avatar
    Yesterday, 11:15 AM
    Hi erc45, welcome to the forum. You say your baby seems particularly fussy- are you comparing her to other children you have had? Were they breast or formula fed? Can you explain a little more what you mean? In my experience newborn babies are normally very fussy, and the baby who is not is the more unusual baby. Green is a normal poop color for many babies and "mucous" is, as far as I know, not proven to indicate allergy or any other issues at all. I am confused. Aside the poop look and newborn rash, was there some other problem- like slow gain? Or breastfeeding hurting you or not feeling right for you perhaps? What you are describing with the green "mucous" poops, baby acne, and fussy baby all sounds entirely normal to me and as long as baby was gaining ok and nursing comfortable for you, then I am not sure why you would think you had to give baby formula? Your baby's doctor told you baby was doing fine on breastmilk, and you are not finding there is any significant improvement with the switch to formula...right? So, I am not sure why you are not just tossing the formula and going back to nursing baby? It would be a lot easier than what you are doing now.
    5 replies | 99 view(s)
  • @llli*erc45's Avatar
    Yesterday, 10:55 AM
    So long story short, baby girl has consistent green mucous poops with breast milk. She also seems like a particularly fussy baby. Only other symptom is flesh colored bumps all around her temples and forehead (could just be sensitive skin or baby acne). 2 week checkup doc said "it doesn't seem to bother her, she's fine". Wasn't convinced so started Alimentum 1 week ago with occasional comfort nursing (maybe 1x every day for a few minutes). Her poops are now brown green but still SO slimy and shiny looking. I'm pumping to keep up my supply, but I'm so emotionally exhausted racking my brain on what to do. I really really want to BF, but feel like I should continue the formula to experiment. Does anyone have experience with dairy intolerance or mucous poops? I wonder at what point I should just stop pumping and accept that she might need formula. Or should I resume BF maybe this week and see if her fussiness and poops change?
    5 replies | 99 view(s)
  • @llli*maddieb's Avatar
    Yesterday, 10:48 AM
    Hi bettyb, many moms who were not able to breastfeed as long as they liked (or at all) with one baby find things go completely ok with the next. So it is possible all will be fine with this baby as far as breastfeeding goes. Since your oldest child was tongue tied, that alone may have accounted for the slow gain. There is evidence that tongue tie can run in families. If you find new baby is not gaining well, do you have a path to have tongue tie diagnosed and treated where you are? When tongue tie is the issue, early treatment makes all the difference. But tongue tie may not have been the issue, or only part of it. If you have any breastfeeding difficulties in the early days, do you know if there is a professional IBCLC you can see? Volunteer LLL Groups or other breastfeeding support near you? My first suggestion is to build your support network NOW rather than scrambling for help in those crazy early days with a newborn. If you find your baby truly needs supplementing, this can be done in a way that is less negatively impactful on breastfeeding. We can provide info here in that event. There are things you can do to get breastfeeding off to a great start. You do not say when baby is due, but if you have time, my best suggestion is the get the book The Womanly Art of Breastfeeding (8th edition) and read the first 6 chapters (they are not long) or read as much as you can. Bring it too the hospital too (assuming this will be a hospital birth.)
    2 replies | 79 view(s)
  • @llli*djs.mom's Avatar
    Yesterday, 08:54 AM
    4days is really early to give up. It sounds like your milk just came in right now. And they aren't supposed to gauge the weight until you are a lot farther in then 4days. They dont' expect the baby to be back up to birth weight until the week point? Maybe the 2 week point? And a newborn can live just fine on Colostrom alone for days. My milk didn't come in for 5 days. I nursed on demand and he was fine. Although that 1st 5 days he didn't gain anyweight. My nurses werent' alarmed so neither was I. They said as long as he had wet diapers we were fine. He did. I didn't trip. Cluster feeding isn't every 2hours. That's NORMAL day to day breastfeeding. Cluster feeding is the baby wanting to feed non-stop for hours. Like every time you try to take the baby off the breast, the look like this :eek::eek: Wide eyes wide mouth. It happens in the very beginning when they are working to get your milk to come in and every time they have a growth spurt and they are working to get your supply to increase due to their growth. Don't confuse the way formula works for satisfaction on the part of your baby. Formula is not as easily or as completely absorbed as breastmilk. It is harder for babies to digest, it takes longer and creates more waste. So, the baby DOES go longer between feeds but those are the reasons. Nipple confusion is real. And it sounds like your baby might have it. But at 4 days old you can totally get your baby back on track. Have a nurse in. Stay skin to skin with the baby...
    3 replies | 146 view(s)
  • @llli*bettyb's Avatar
    Yesterday, 08:07 AM
    Hi all. I am wondering if any of you have been in a similar situation as myself. I am expecting our second baby and hoping to breastfeed. I tried so hard to breastfeed our first and it just did not work out as I hoped. He was very slow to put on weight (took to week 4 before he was back to birth weight), he had a tongue tie, he had severe silent reflux and at the time it just felt we were fighting a losing battle. At 2 weeks we supplemented with formula which looking back now was the beginning of the end. We did not have the knowledge to come back from this at the time. In hindsight supplementing with formula didn't even help with his weight because it took another 2 weeks for him to get back to birth weight so then it was assumed he was a baby who was naturally slow to put on weight. Followed by a trip to A&E and overnight stay in the hospital because he was vomiting blood and they couldn't say for sure if it was from my nipple (no obvious cuts) or from his oesophagus from the reflux. At 6 weeks our breastfeeding journey ended and it was one of the saddest times for me. I'm sure that sounds crazy to some people but it really was like I was grieving. To this day I still feel guilty thinking what if or if only I had know. What helps is we have the happiest and thank God healthiest little baby now so at least there is that and although much shorter than I had hope I do think him having had breast milk even for that short time has really helped So I am due my...
    2 replies | 79 view(s)
  • @llli*maddieb's Avatar
    July 23rd, 2017, 11:16 PM
    Oh for the severe engorgement you might try cold (or very cool) compresses directly on the breasts, and heat only on your back and shoulders if you are finding heat helpful. If you had IV fluids that can cause edema and that can make the breasts even harder and more swollen. As I am sure you know edema like this will pass in a few days. Here is more info on hand expression: http://www.llli.org/docs/0000000000000001WAB/WAB_Tear_sheet_Toolkit/06_hand_expression.pdf and video http://med.stanford.edu/newborns/professional-education/breastfeeding/hand-expressing-milk.html Engorgement: http://kellymom.com/bf/concerns/mother/engorgement/ If baby cannot latch well or at all due to the engorgement, a nipple shield may help as a temporary measure. More: http://kellymom.com/ages/newborn/nb-challenges/wean-shield/
    3 replies | 146 view(s)
  • @llli*maddieb's Avatar
    July 23rd, 2017, 07:06 PM
    Hi jollycat. In that case, you are probably pumping the perfect amount. Here is a situation where the problem is the numbers. Every mom is going to have different numbers. And they are probably going to be at least a little different each time for each mom as well.So, rather than thinking about pumping for X amount of time or until you get Z amount of milk, it is better to think about how your breast feels. After all the reason you are pumping at all is because you are uncomfortable. Right? So pump until you feel more comfortable- not until you are "empty," and not all the time. Only when baby is not nursing enough to get you to where you feel ok. You are not creating a situation where you will always have to pump by only pumping a little when you feel you really need to in order to be comfortable. Many moms make more than enough at this stage of the game. It might help to encourage baby to nurse more often, this is the best course as there are no potential drawbacks- but it does not always do the trick. So when it does not, some moms hand express as needed, some pump as needed, and some just allow the breast to feel full for a while, or some combination of these. All of these are entirely fine, it is all a matter of degree. Over the next couple weeks, your baby may want more at a time and will probably be taking more overall, although that will only be up until about 5 or 6 weeks. At that point, babies do not need more each day, (a one month old and a 6...
    2 replies | 82 view(s)
  • @llli*jollycat's Avatar
    July 23rd, 2017, 06:29 PM
    Hi, I have an 9 day old who is nursing very well. 8 or more poopy diapers per day and he was back at birth weight at day 7. I saw an IBCLC on day 7 because of engorgement even though he nurses all the time. She suggested I pump 5 minutes when feeling very engorged, with a manual pump, just to relieve discomfort. I've actually only been pumping for 3 minutes, twice per day at the times I feel uncomfortable. I've been getting over 2 ounces with 3 mins so I was nervous to do 5 minutes as she suggested. So in other words, I'm pumping about 4 ounces a day above what baby needs. Is this too much? Will his appetite eventually increase so he wants these four ounces, or am I just creating a situation where I'll always have to pump? I'm not trying to create an oversupply. I will be returning to work in an office one day per week but I'll be pumping there, so I'm not trying to stockpile a freezer stash. I would say it takes me about that much to feel comfortable but maybe it's because he's so young. What do you think? Thank you!
    2 replies | 82 view(s)
  • @llli*maddieb's Avatar
    July 23rd, 2017, 12:37 PM
    Hi mindylane, I am sorry you have been having a difficult time. So, of course breastfeeding is still possible! Oh my gosh, baby is only 4 days? Many newborns who do not nurse at this point nurse fine later. Some babies take many weeks before they are able to latch and nurse. However there is no reason to think that will be the case here. I think you are set to get baby nursing just fine in the next few days because baby has shown they can latch and nurse and you are making milk. First I would suggest see the appropriate professional for the issue you are having. Your baby is refusing to nurse, or for some reason cannot nurse effectively. The professional trained to help in that circumstance is not a doctor but a board certified lactation consultant (IBCLC.) Here is an article about what to expect at an appointment with an IBCLC: http://www.cwgenna.com/lconsult.html As long as baby is not nursing, it is imperative that you pump at least 8 times in 24 hours. Some moms find hand expression works better, or you can alternate. It does not matter as long as the milk is being removed effectively and frequently somehow. Please, I beg you, try not to worry about how much you get out when you pump. It is never much at this age, it is not supposed to be! Also pumps are not babies, they are a substitute and even the best ones may not do what a baby can. And what a baby takes in a bottle is totally irrelevant. OK, let's talk about weight gain. Typical weight loss shortly...
    3 replies | 146 view(s)
  • @llli*mindylane's Avatar
    July 23rd, 2017, 09:46 AM
    Hi. I just had my baby 4 days ago on the 19th. I really wanted to exclusively breastfeed and as a NICU nurse, I felt pretty confident that I'd be able to. However, it has been nothing but frustration. I thought he started out ok; he'd latch and suck but would get frustrated. I saw lactation at the hospital and she made some suggestions so I thought we'd be good. He ended up losing 8% of his weight by day 2, but they were fine with that. He started getting more and more frustrated with every feed, even though I was feeding him pretty much on demand... usually every 2 hours. We assumed he was cluster feeding. By the time he saw the pediatrician, he had lost 13% of his weight and it turns out I was just literally starving him. The pediatrician suggested supplementing with formula until my milk came in. I was really against it but also didn't want him to lose more weight. My husband fed him maybe 3 bottles over the course of 24 hours and I started pumping. I first pumped .7mL, then 4, then 12. But he would still take 35-60mL from the formula each time. I woke up this morning and my breasts are wildly engorged. They are so incredibly painful and I guess that's why he was getting so frustrated. The milk is there but it isn't making its way out. I'm trying hot compresses, massage, pumping every 2 hours... I'm barely getting anything out and they're rock hard and painful. We saw the pediatrician again this morning. Of course he gained a ton of weight. Thanks to...
    3 replies | 146 view(s)
  • @llli*teach48's Avatar
    July 22nd, 2017, 04:24 PM
    Thank you so much! I appreciate the resources you included and in the depth information you provided! Makes me feel a little better about it all! :)
    2 replies | 126 view(s)
  • @llli*maddieb's Avatar
    July 22nd, 2017, 11:39 AM
    Hi teach48! So there are many things to consider when a mom is pumping part of the day and baby is getting bottles at that time due to separations. Having a good understanding of how milk production works and how bottle feeding can be done to minimize overfeeding will help you meet your goals of providing your milk for your child and protecting your milk production after you return to work. The lactating breasts are making milk all the time, 24 hours a day. Longer periods of 5-6 hours of no milk removal tend to happen around this age, in particular overnight, without it being any problem for milk production, as long as milk removal is still happening frequently and effectively enough overall. And milk can be removed from the breasts at any time. So there is really no such thing as a "missed" pumping session. If pumping break time at work is not optimal, if needed and if you choose, you could pump when you are home, or encourage your baby to nurse more often overnight/weekends in order to protect your milk production, or pump some other time during your work day even if that means two pump sessions are close together, or some combination of these. (If you are uncomfortable going that long without pumping, you may need to find a way to at least quickly hand express to relieve pressure, which will protect your health and your milk production, even if you are not able to save that milk.) My first suggestion is to make sure breastfeeding is going very well before...
    2 replies | 126 view(s)
  • @llli*teach48's Avatar
    July 22nd, 2017, 10:39 AM
    I will be going back to work in the next few weeks. As a teacher, I won't be able to pump as often as my 5 (then 6 month) daughter nurses. It looks like I will be skipping one feeding session, going about 5 hours. If I skip a pumping session, supplementing with frozen breastmilk, and then formula, as needed, will my supply hold when I pump or breastfeed other times of the day? I know it's not ideal, but I think it's what I have to work with. Will I be able to nurse on the weekends still? I am also concerned because when I pump I don't generally produce as much as she eats, so I am concerned in general about pumping. I have been pumping at night to build up a stash, but a few ounces a day will go quickly. What's been your experience? I am trying not to freak out about it all.
    2 replies | 126 view(s)
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